Thursday, March 20, 2008

YANKEES VS METS: STARTING PITCHING

By passing on Johan Santana this past off season, the Yankees sent the baseball world a message loud and clear, that they are going to try and win through a way they have been shying away from for a while now. That is to stick with the kids, and trust the farm system .

Personally, I thought it was a very questionable move to say the least, but I hope to G-D that it pays off. I still am very skeptical on Hughes and company. We see it happen so often that young phenom pitchers turn out to be busts. Johan is a proven dominant lefty ace. But lets not get into this argument. The topic at hand is the New York Yankees starting pitching TODAY.

With out getting into stats(because I gave my stat predictions already. http://samiamsports.blogspot.com/2008/01/sam-i-ams-yankee-stat-predictions.html)
I'm going to give you a basic overview on the Yankee rotation.

40 Chien-Ming Wang
46 Andy Pettitte
34 Phil Hughes
36 Ian Kennedy
35 Mike Mussina
(62 Joba Chamberlain )

This starting 5/6 has question marks all over it. Especially with the Innings cap situation

Wang and Pettitte are the only two certainties in this "rotation of question marks".Year after year we get more or less the same kind of production and we know what we could expect from them.

After that , your guess is as good as mine.
Hughes definitely has the moxie and the make up of a major leaguer, but what can we really expect from a guy that hasn't pitched a full season in the majors and is coming off an injury riddled rookie year?
It wouldn't be fair to get on Phil's case if he has an average season . We must give this kid at least a year or two to develop.
Then we have the same story with IPK, although in the few major league outings last year Kennedy shinned. We cant expect the world from this kid either.
Mike Mussina is an aging vet that hasn't figured out that his fastball decreased 7-8 MPH since his prime. For a guy that's supposed to smart, sure isn't showing it. Since moose got that 2 year extension (probably one of the dumbest moves in Cashman's tenure) he hasn't proved that he can adapt to where his stuff is NOW.
Finally , We have the Joba situation. I strongly disagree with the Yankees on putting him in the pen to start the season. Its just an excuse to have a stop gap until they figure out what they have. Reason being... they are mortified, and rightfully so. But its not an excuse to tamper with what could be " the best next pitcher in baseball ".

The up side is definitely there , but your fooling yourself if you want to tell me that these guys are going to be instant stars.
As a big Yankee fan, I'm wouldn't be surprised if this year is kind of like a rebuilding /win now kind of season (Meaning to say , the Yankee organization wont be pissed if they fall short yet again). If the pitching isn't up to par, The offense will for sure carry them anywhere near playoff contention.
Gun to my head...I say they make it with this staff(obviously barring major injuries). Just because Joba will be a starter( I hope).
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Here's the Mets side:

With the acquisition of Johan Santana the Mets rotation is #1 in NYit looks like this:Johan SantanaJohn MaineOliver PerezPedro MartinezMike Pelfrey(El Duque)I put Pedro 4th because I believe that both oliver and maine will have better records than him this year as well as more starts...Johan Santana needs no description, he is the best pitcher in baseball and his numbers can only go up going from the AL to the NL.I dont think I need to say anything further on him.Oliver Perez and John Maine's numbers both have gotten better since they came over to the mets they were both 15-10 last year in an up and down kind of year. Through the first 4 months of the year, both of their ERA's were around 3 and then ended off at 3.56 and 3.91. They both continue to improve and I am looking at more wins out of each of them this year. Oliver Perez is part of a small class of lefties that can throw 95 mph and higher.Seeing how Pedro pitched last season. You can be confident that he will put up good numbers this year as well. He probably will only get 23-27 starts this season I Just pray his arm doesnt fall off this year.Unlike alot of people I am extremely high on Mike Pelfrey.I believe he is brandon Webb in the making. He has a great sinking fastball that will make hitters pound the ball in the ground. Once he gains more confidence he will show how good he can be at this level.In his first 4 starts last september he went 3-0 with a 3.48 ERA including a gem that knocked the braves out of the playoffs. One number that jumps off the page is that his ERA on a 0-0 count is 45.00 but all other counts is just a 0.00. I dont know if thats a typo, but thats amazing. http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/7807/situational;_ylt=AiaHPttzwp6.kct8JwmBTVmFCLcFSo it seems to me that he just has to work on his first pitch selection and he'll be fine...Also el Duque, I have no clue what to expect from him but the mets were 16-8 in his 24 starts last season. So while he is injury prone, I feel comfortable if hes the 6th starter that can come in when pedro or any other pitcher needs a rest...I think the mets win this hands down....individually:Mets win #1Mets win #2- Because Andy was 15-9 140k and 4.05 era and either maine or perz had better ERA and at least 35-40 more k's, and pettitte has this whole steroid scandal and maine and perez are entering their prime and andy is turning 36 in june. Andy's whip is 1.43 maine's whip 1.27Mets win #3Mets win #4#5, you can argue Kennedy vs Pelfrey , but like I said Pelfrey showed you at the end of last year he can pitch and Kennedy in my opinion should have been traded this offseason because his value will never be that high again...

OUTCOME
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First Base -Mets

Second Base- Yankees

Short Stop- Reluctantly Yankees but very skeptical ( Jeter will probably have the better year but Reyes has the potential to be GREAT. )

Third Base- Yankees without question

Catcher- Yankees (Yanks win this in a laugher)

Center Field- Mets (In a landslide)

Right Field-Yankees (Church is unproven and Abreu is on his walk year)

Left Field-Yankees (Alou cant stay on the field)

Starting Pitching-Mets (Half the Yankee rotation is unproven and the other half is an injury waiting to happen.)

21 comments:

abie said...

do u think that since girardi burned out dontrelle willis in florida that it will affect his decision with the young yankee arms..like we are seeing with joba...or is this strictly a cashman move?

Max said...

PECKER YOU ARE AN IDIOT!!!!!!!

Granted i will give you that the mets have a better rotaion because of Santana but not by much!!!!!

YES santana is the best pitcher in baseball and i would never ever argue about that but if you look at the numbers of Wang and Santana last year it is

Johan- 15-13-3.33-183(hits)
Wang- 19-7-3.7-199

Now like i said before i am no way saying that Wang is better but the numbers show that Wang is no slouch either especially if he can develop that 4th pitch that everyone is saying he will

Johan- 10
Wang-8.25

Predictions

Johan-21-7 - 2.66
Wang-18-8 - 3.56


NOW PECKERRRRRRRRRRRR

Here is where you sound like an idiot: Let me just say this i like John Maine alot BUT......

In no way shape or form can you even consider Maine in the same breath as Andy

Andy (AL)- 15-9 - 4.05
Maine (NL)- 15-10 - 3.91


Any one that watched the yankees on a daily basis last year knows that Andy should have had 18-20 wins last year had it not been for the yankees inconsistency in the bullpen early in the year the guy had games where he had 1-2 ER in 7-8 innings and he ends up getting a no dec. He was as consist as you can be and is the reason taht they yankees were able to win some games in the early part of the season when the lefties werent hitting. His consistency was outstanding. Against the top teams in the league he had a 2.6 ERA

Boston-6.1- 2ER
Sea- 7.1- 2ER
Mets- 7-3ER
Boston- 7- 1ER
Boston - 4.1- 5ER
Arizon- 8 - 1ER
Angels - 5- 8ER
Cleveland- 7.1- 1ER
DET- 8- 1ER
Angels- 7 -1ER
Boston- 7 - 3ER
Boston- 4 - 4ER

CLevland - Playoff- 6.1- 0ER

THE GUY IS A MONEY PITCHER!!!!


MAine on the other hand who i think will be a very good pitcher in this league was a very inconsistent pitcher who when pitching in the NL CAN never be considered a number 2 pitcher if he has over a 3.5 ERA

Andy-8
Maine- 7.25

Predictions

Andy- 17-6 - 3.50
Maine- 16-8- 3.42

i will do the rest a little later stay tuned

Louis Husney said...

Lets not forget El Duque lost his leg kick, and now that he is not able to hide the ball the way he used to we can see the results....look at what he did against the Cards in his new pitching style debut.....


3 IP 5 runs and two walks thats an ERA of 15....while I know this is only one game I dont think we can consider El Duque to be the pitcher he was last year

abie said...

ummm..i understand el duque....and max...u do understand that the mets team fell apart last season including their bullpen...so dont go ripping maine on his stats just yet...and if u believe that he isnt as good then fine then put oliver there cuz he is definitely better then pettitte...

i know that wang is great...i never said otherwise but santana is better..

and i know pettitte is money but facts are that maine and oliver are getting better every yr...and no person in baseball would say yeh ill take pettitte over maine or oliver...its just ridiculous...

and which ever one u choose to beat pettitte..the other one beats whoever u have at 3...i mean i have a yankee fan that admittingly says that if u take pedro this yr and comapare against pettitte that that is a wash...so...stop saying how great ur 36 yr old pitcher is..he has back problems...and admitted that he has pain in his arm now...so relax...

call me an idiot all u want..but ur arguing for an old guy with arm and back issues...and havent given any blessings to pedro yet..

abie said...

i agree with you louis that el duque wont be the pitcher he was last yr..i mean any sane person can see that...but being the 6th starter or filling in a start for pedro in june/july isnt asking much and he prob will be ready by then...

also dont come to me with Spring training stats..if u want some then look at Maine...1.78 era and today 6 innings 7 k 1 hit 1 bb...and wangs era is 8.44...

so dont look at ST..please...

oh and if maine cant be considered as a #2 with over a 3.5 era then how can pettitte if hes only getting older...and maine and oliver are on their upside...

abie said...

ill place any bets u want that andy wont get 17 wins...any amount!!!

abie said...

andy gave up 5 or more runs 7 times
maine 5 times...oliver 3 times

abie said...

its so funny how u believe that andy's stats will improve from last year..i ligit am laughing out loud...17-6 3.50 era... hahahahahhahahahahahaha..wow!!

abie said...

btw this discussion is over PUT IT IN THE BOOKS!

we should have the bullpen up soon...

Max said...

NO WAY IN HELL WOULD I TAKE MAINE OR PEREZ OVER ANDY THIS YEAR!!! you would have to be out of your mind and if you wanna talk about old pitchers well your god of pedro is 37! whos hasnt pitched a full season in 2 YEARS and your best pitcher last year was 65!!!!! so dont start telling me about how old andy is ...


And about the 3.5 era i was talking about in the NATIONAL LEAGUE! you cannot seriously think that the national league numbers can even compare to american league numbers!!!!


and Oli Perez????????????

are you kidding me ????

the guy had only 1 solid year in his career which was last year 15-10- 3.56 which the numbers translate to american legue numbers of 15-10 - 4.30

So dont start lecturing me on oliver perez the guy is one of the most inconsistent pitchers i have ever seen . I mean you never know what your gonna get with this guy, and when the mets needed him most down the strech the guy throws a 5 era in the last two months so dont give this garbage about oli perez

Max said...

o and you know what makes me laugh pecker is that every year since i can remember ive had mets fans comming to me after evry season telling me we will win next year and before every season telling me this is our year i just know it and the facts remain that i have witnessed 4 world championships while you my friend have witnessed none!

abie said...

max u just threw away any credibility u ever had!!!

from now on i know who i am talking too...i thought u knew baseball...that thought is over...

oliver in 2004 had 196IP 239K 81BB and 2.98 ERA 1.15WHIP and .207 BAA 2CG

the whole deal with oliver was getting him back to that point which threw the first 4 months last yr he was...

wow....

oh and i said that i never gave pedro any blessings...i know i will get little from him...

abie said...

max...if u know me i always have said in the past when the yankees were winning the world championships...that they were better..i understand the yanks were better...but that is an argument now...so laugh all u want about the past...is it embarrassing that the mets lost to the cards in 06 YES...is it embarrassing that the mets collapsed last yr YES...but the true baseball fan always comes back the next yr...and if u look at what the mets have now...a mets fan is coming back to the nl favorite after the embarrassing historic collapse...up until and 06 i said yanks are better...i took the heat then...and im hoping u can take it when the tide turns against you...

Morris M. said...

any amount abie? I'll put down a G that says pettite gets 16 wins... samIam can hold the money.

Lev Aharon said...

just confirmed by the yankees...Joba is NOT starting!

SploggerDon said...

putting pedro 4th is the stupidest thing i ever heard come out of any blogger/colomnist EVER!

he will have a great season and is proven with 3 cy youngs, there is no reason to disrespect pedro matinez and put him 4th, if it was up to me just due to his veteranness i woulda started him first!

RALPH said...

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abie said...

this just in on wang his era on the road for the past 3 yrs avg is 4.85..wow...and opp ba is over 300 the past 2 yrs...i never knew that he was that bad on the road...all that said..he does pitch great at home...and his record is still 17-6 on the road over the past 2 yrs...

SAM I AM said...

CAPSMAN YOU WERE MISSED DEARLY
(mabrook btw)

SAM I AM

abie said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
abie said...

btw the mets starters era last yr..was 4.40..and the yanks was 4.57...and the mets added johan...and will have pedro this yr...and lost glavines 4.45 era....

also the mets starters struck out 716 batters compared to 574 of the yankees..and again with johan and pedro that number will go up...

and BBA WAS .256 to the yankees .276

prob should have put this in my post..